Saint, Step Up! in Meeting Mr. Jesus Christ

One place I keep my mouth shut and gently let my Christian life be exposed is Facebook. It's a firestorm waiting to happen, but occasionally a door will open. I don't walk through those doors because frankly I basically am not prepared so strongly to get caught in a fight between God and Satan's workers. I'm still a student waiting to become prophet.

But today along comes an article about one of the never ending exposed ills of 'The Church". It wasn't a new issue, only the next, sad episode. I made a simple comment that spilled into a lengthy thread. I want to share it here, mostly because I want to remember this time in my walk, knowing where I once was and to some day look back and compare once again.

The article, should you care to read it can be found here, http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/a-network-of-homes-where-children-s-happiness-was-relentlessly-destroyed-1.1672331?page=1

COMMENTS (mine in bold)

"Control...total control...sick SICK sickening" Like · 1

SICK. My stomach feels sick, too.

This is one of the many reasons for the Church, as an institution, to get the hell out of influencing laws, political decisions, and so on and so forth. Run your small c churches and get away from the Inquisition mentality.

Personally I do not participate in the church that supports this mentality, though due to not paying attention to indoctrination I did at one time. When I woke up I walked away and never looked back. If any "church body" I am part of is not based solely in love and the workings of Christs' calling I am not of that body. With that as my personal doctrine I assure you finding a church to be fully a part of, where I profess and live my beliefs is not easily found, especially as a woman. And as a woman, I accept my role within the church is one of submission by Biblical standards. Like · 1

you ACCEPT that! You accept a role of submission????? · Like

If you read the scriptures regarding this (it's extensive) then you will understand it is a hierarchy. Man submits to Christ (the church) and leads his wife and family. The woman is submissive to the husband (and as such, the leadership of Christ) and is the help meat to her husband/Christ. This isn't a negative position, rather one that builds trust, unity and a family under God's sovereign authority. Like

I take you have a different view? · Like · 1

Yes. I believe in the shortness of our lives with mortality a sure outcome, and that given the brevity which has no guarantees as to how much time we actually HAVE got to live we must do everything we can to live our lives as fully and richly as possible as well as trying our hardest to be kind and help others and leave the world a better and more beautiful place...to hope we made a difference by existing. There is no time to be submissive and a follower. The point is to learn and LEARN everything you can in order to have something to contribute and the intelligence and wisdom of being able to make your own decisions. Edited · Like · 3

the scriptures also state that a woman was created from Adam's rib so that she would be at his side as an EQUAL...if you go by scriptures...then again, there is a lot to do with slavery, stoning, incest and such as well in the scriptures...hard to live by them given society finds a lot of it offensive...the scriptures are anti-gay as well, and anti-gay goes against my personal beliefs.... · Like · 1

I also keep in mind the fact that the bible was written by MEN with an idea to subduing the women in their world, and men keep using their "holy books" to subjugate women. It's wrong, plain and simple. It's wrong in Islam, it's wrong in Christianity, it's just wrong. It's a terrific way to keep people from thinking for themselves, and men are terrified of women who can think for themselves and ask hard questions. When women submit, it opens the doors for men to do as they will, including any kind of horror to children. My mother refused to submit to my father's violence, although, as a good Catholic woman, she should have. She saw it more her duty to defy his violence and to protect her children, although the bible would have her do the opposite. Bullshit to that! When submission means leaving others open to harm, no way...just, no. Edited · Like · 1

"When submission means leaving others open to harm, no way...just, no." I could not agree more. · Like · 1

So you don't accept the role of submissive woman without question, which means you don't accept it completely. Good for you. Also add in, "when submission means leaving myself open to harm, no way." · Edited · Like

oh...and there's that other little thing...often the man is not as smart as the woman or as good a person...or right...and yet the woman should do his will simply because he is male? It doesn't make any sense, and I would never bring my daughters up to believe that what they think or have to offer is of less worth than a man. NEVER. Some men and women are equally brilliant...but that has nothing to do with their gender. Gender is not a trump card in my mind. And I value myself and my daughters and girlfriends far too much to sweep their dreams and strengths into submission...no can do. Like · 1

No, I do not accept "submissive" as accepting abuse, nor in a non-Biblical way. Biblically when a woman submits she is submitting to Christ (the church) and that is love, and is in agreement with your "do no harm" belief system. · Like

no...not the same...not until you take out the submissive to the husband, Christ, church, god...and stop believing those are the only means of unity and peace... · Like

no submissiveness...none. Stand tall and proud and equal · Like · 1

we have the ability to make things VERY good for everyone on this planet...one of the key things holding us back is the submitting to doctrines simply because we are taught to · Like

There are many men who aren't smart or as close to God as the Christian woman. That is a challenging position, still the Christian woman can be an example of proper living and direction for her children as well as her husband. This doesn't carry any promises, yet in my book whether one is of a faith or not setting a proper and consistent example of living has much to do with the solidarity of family life. One expects their children to submit to guidelines at school, in public within reasonable circumstances, etc. For me being militant and demanding my position be thee position has not served the greater good of family or community as a rule. Like·

You can compromise and work for the greater good without "submission". Following societal rules may be considered submission, I suppose, but I don't define it that same way. And guidelines and rules, within reason, should be followed, but there are rules that should be abandoned, as in the example in the article above. Those schools are what happened when the nuns submitted their humanity to the Church, the priests, the bishops and so on. Had they any moral courage at all, and had they not been raised to submit to the will of the Church, those schools would not have happened.

Exactly. There are those who do not believe their brains are meant to be used...they blindly accept and submit to what is expected of them. "Within reasonable circumstances" yes...apart from that I have taught my children never to blindly accept...question when you doubt...insist on valid reasons and explanations · Like

My mum raised me to question the Church, and all men all the time. lol · Like · 1

Fully in agreement with you, C. Where I am coming from is not a position of submission to society, the rules of men in society, but Christ and a man (or the Christian man) who is actively living a Christian life. I would not participate in this belief system of mine were it with a partner that didn't also believe as a Christian. It simply couldn't work. People need to be evenly yoked. · Like

No one should be yoked · Like

I assure you of one thing, I am not blind. B, I enjoy discussion on many topics, but I don't participate in angry argument. I have nothing here to defend. My life is simply a way of living. Clearly you see differently and I have no intention making attempts to bend your mind in any direction. Stand strong. · Like · 1

Well, I agree that if you're "yoked" as in working as a team to accomplish mutual goals, then yes, both partners must be as equal as possible, but you still wouldn't find me letting any man in my life having the final say JUST because he's The Man. · Like · 1

There has to be give and take. · Unlike · 2

LOL C. I though you were going to say no man is putting a yoke on you! · Like · 1

...and not in the "I give and he takes" meaning. · Like · 1

she'd go down fighting · Unlike · 2

I'd never get into it with her. She likes mud and has strong hands. I'm a wimp and would lose before she gave me a chance to hit the floor. · Like

B knows me well. And the longer I'm on my own, the less I want a man underfoot. I don't need a husband, I need a mom--someone to do stuff for me without expecting much in return. Husbands are too much work. lol · Like · 1

C, did you think for a moment I had doubts of your position. BWaaahahahahahhahahahahaa · Like

And C, as I tell my clients, I'll cheerfully hurt you, but I'll do my best not to harm you. There's a difference. · Unlike · 1

Yeah there is. That is why one of my wild desires is to have you massage me. The girl I go to leaves me bruised, and we are good friends! · Like

C, I know there are some that need to feel as you do for the peace that comes with it. Chances are I may never know that peace because I never find all my answers. But if that is the way you have chosen I have to respect your choice for yourself. I have other friends who feel as strongly as you do. I simply cannot understand the not questioning and pushing myself further...and I cannot forget all the wrongs that have been done...I cannot turn away from that and ever justify it by submission. For some women it absolves them of responsibility and the stress that goes with making decisions. I have seen women in my community let man be the master of the household (grew up that way even) and it did nothing to convince me that this is as it should be...it made me balk and fight for women's rights. Even as I child I felt it was wrong. I can never ever become a person who accepts it. · Like · 2

If she's leaving bruises, she's doing it wrong. I've been doing massage, including deep tissue, for almost 23 years, and I very seldom leave bruises. One day, C. · Unlike · 2

Yes B, we all have our personal journey. I find it peculiar I have found myself walking with Christ. My life experience with men is beyond horrifying, it's been full of inexcusable and unforgivable behaviors, yet here I am at a place of forgiveness and peace. Life doesn't have a reason, it's a journey. I simply enjoy it to the fullest, learn all I can, love always and when all else fails hang on until the situation passes. During all, no matter what I choose to keep my faith. Who knows what tomorrow will bring. Nice chatting with you ladies. · Like · 2

I know a bit about your experiences, and if you're in a happy and safe place now, then really, that's all that matters. · Unlike · 2

Yes C, you know enough to understand there is joy in my statement. · Like · 1

that's what counts is for you to find your joy...that is key for making the world happier and better. I'm glad for you · Edited · Like

Thanks B. I wish the same for you. · Like · 1

blessings to you and may your joy last always · Like